Hello, please know I feel like a fool. So, my grandparents have always helped me with money when needed. No illegal activity or drugs, just married young with kids and broke. Anytime I asked for help they gladly did it. Honestly, if they hadn’t, I would have stopped asking. We were very close. They got me a car when I needed it, very fortunate to be able to help. I am POA, signed all the stuff. I think I will be executor when the time comes. They have everything in an estate that I do not manage (that has more than enough for them to live comfortably) except a checking account for anything needed. I am an owner also on the account. Long ago I started writing checks to myself when needed-and agreed on, they knew! They also help pay for my kids school. So one has passed and one has dementia. I do the same as I always have, if I need help with bills I write a check. Saw something on TV about embezzlement and decided to google it. Am I committing embezzlement? I feel like a total idiot and I am terrified. I never ever would pay for anything I thought they would say no to. Do I need a lawyer? Please any advice appreciated please know I feel absolutely horrible.
Your grandparents are not your atm.
There could be issues with the situation, now that one gparent has passed and the other is not competent.
IDK if this is embezzlement, I'm not a lawyer, but you should definitely get the legal end of this dealt with.
Are you telling us there is some question in your mind about that?
She is so sharp that she asked me if I’d make a spreadsheet of all my monthly expenses and asked for a grand total to help me with the house. Can you imagine? A 100 yr. old wanting a spreadsheet, but, her deceased husband made them all the time. I couldn’t do it. But, I will take some money here and there. I know a lot about Medicaid lookback, etc. as we have an elderlaw attorney. We were advised to open up a Disabled Child account for her to “gift” money. That is Medicaid exempt. I questioned it over and over, but, attorneys for the bank that reviewed the application said it’s done all the time. It’s unusual because of the gifter is the older person and the recipient is her 76 year old son! Usually, people are in the opposite situation. Two of his doctor specialists must write certified letters to the bank and the attorney must write a letter stating the “child” (age isn’t a factor - he’s her son no matter what) is 100% disabled. He is terminal now and has very little time. MIL is hoping I take something now before I go broke. I pay over $16,00/month for his care. I doubt she’ll need Medicaid as she has 7 figures, but, life is strange and you never know…….. so far, she’s lost all her adult children and husband.
Sorry I went on and on, but, there are so many individual situations that require explanation before someone is labeled a thief, evil, embezzler, etc. I know when my own parents were alive my mother (no dementia) gave me her checkbook and said “help yourself because I don’t need all that money!” I wanted to go shopping with a friend and she gave me a check for $10,000 and said “have fun”! My dad was even more generous. I guess I was blessed, but, not with my wonderful husband’s illness. I’d give it all back to have him and his brain normal again.
I don’t think Boucheran should be made to feel like a criminal when she was offered help all her life. She feels weird about it now because her family dynamic has changed with a death and dementia so give her some credit. That’s why she asked the question.
You should return the money you have been taking from the remaining grandparent with dementia .
If this grandparent needs Medicaid within 5 years of the last time you gifted yourself , you could potentially be in trouble with the law . As well as your grandparent would be denied Medicaid .
I don’t understand why you thought it was morally ok to continue to write yourself checks when the grandparent with dementia is no longer competent .
You rationalize it by saying they always had enough to live on and they’ve always agreed to it before and now only feel bad when you find out you are embezzling .
I feel bad that you went to all the trouble of asking a very serious question as you have a concern you may be in the wrong. To be chastised by people you came for advice is like the politicians who are in the news now! The labels on people - geeeeez …………. sure give advice that may be useful as hard as it may be to hear because it is the truth. But, calling someone criminal names is scary and you just came for advice by asking a question. Some people act (or react) like you took your grandmother and pushed her wheelchair into rush hour traffic on the highway!
Just don’t write anymore checks to yourself! Good luck!
OP asked if this was embezzlement . It is embezzlement In the eyes of the law, which is a crime .
This is the answer to the “ very serious question” .
Ignorance won’t stand up in court either .
If she’s the actual poa why doesn’t she know about this estate that apparently is taking care of the demented grandma?
1) Have your grandparents always been well off, to the point where they could easily afford the way that they have subsidised you?
2) How have their finances been managed in the past? Is anyone else keeping a record – for example for income tax purposes, or for the ‘estate that you do not manage’? What records are available for you? Has there been anyone else ‘keeping an eye on this’?
3) Who else gets money from them? Are you the only person they have been so generous to? Is anyone else likely to create problems for you, or accuse you of doing the wrong thing?
4) Who else besides you might expect to inherit from the estate of the survivor? Are they likely to question what you have done? Some charity beneficiaries are quite keen on getting every penny, so they might matter too.
5) You are also ‘an owner on the (checking) account’. Do you use it for your own purposes, including depositing your money into it, as well as writing checks on it? Has it effectively been ‘our account’, or effectively ‘their account’ for which you can sign? Do you have a separate account of your own, as well as this one?
6) Who else knows that this has been going on for years? Importantly, will they back you up in confirming that it was happening by agreement long before dementia came on the scene?
It would be a very good idea to separate your finances and keep proper records at this point. However you can probably get an idea of how much of a problem this is, from the answers to all these questions. If you think it is likely to cause problems (eg someone else wants to inherit and is going to accuse you of ‘stealing’), sort out the facts first. Then yes it would probably be a good idea to take the whole thing to a lawyer. Even doing just that, before any problems arise and as soon as you have realised that you may be questioned, will probably stand you in good stead.